Hayley Scherders, Living over the influence Season 2, Ep. 19

In episode 19 we had the pleasure of speaking with another fellow Canadian, Hayley Scherders.  Hayley broke free from her addiction to alcohol and cocaine almost 3yrs ago. By doing so she has discovered her own passion for helping others break through the cycle of addiction. Inspired by Anne Grace and certified through This Naked Mind, Hayley has created her own  Recovery Coaching program called Living over the influence.  Combining her unique approach with some This Naked Mind influence, Hayley is creating her own path in the online recovery community.

To find out more about the services Hayley offers through Living over the influence connect with her on Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/livingovertheinfluence/

Notable Mentions:
Annie Grace, This Naked Mind
https://thisnakedmind.com/
Joe Dispenza
https://drjoedispenza.com/
The Perfection Detox, Petra Kolber
https://petrakolber.com/book-the-perfection-detox/
The Mountain is you, Brianna Wiest
https://www.amazon.ca/Mountain-You-Transforming-Self-Sabotage-Self-Mastery/dp/1949759229

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Tracey: https://www.instagram.com/tnd1274/
Kelly: https://www.instagram.com/pamperedkel/
Lindsey: https://www.instagram.com/hariklindsey/

**Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this episode are not professional or medical opinions. If you are struggling with an addiction please contact a medical professional for help.

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Song: Rise and Thrive
Artist: Young Presidents

Resources:
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Transcript

Kelly: 0:03

welcome to the LAF life podcast, a lifestyle podcast based on living alcohol free and a booze soaked world. My name is Kelly Evans and together with my friends, Tracey Djordjevic, Mike Sutton and Lindsay Harik. We share uncensored. Unscripted real conversations about what our lives have been like since we ditched alcohol and how we got here by sharing our individual stories. We'll show you that there isn't just one way to do this, no matter where you are on your journey from sober, curious to years in recovery and everyone in between, you are welcome here, no judgment and a ton of support.

0:43

Hello, everyone. Welcome to the LAF life. Podcast. This is season two and episode 19. Tonight. We have the pleasure of interviewing another wonderful guest. Hayley Scherders. Haley is a recovery coach and she can be found online. at living over the influence. Fluence We met Haley through our online. Line sober community. And we're so excited to have her here tonight to. to. share with Us her personal journey as well as tell us about her business I know Hayley very passionate about giving back to the community since she became sober herself. Two and a half years ago, so Hailey, why don't you start telling us a little bit about your own personal journey with alcohol?

Hayley: 1:26

Okay. Thank you for having me by the way. I'm very excited to be here. I honestly usually struggle with where do I start? How do I even peel back the layers of my story? But to be honest with you, if I go back to the very beginning, And if I reflect on my drinking, I was always a binge drinker. I didn't think that I was at the time. I was like, oh, no, I've got it in control. And I can honestly think back to times when people would ask me if I was drinking and I would be like, no, I'm fine. Or oh, Haley, you're pretty. And I'm like, oh no, I'm good. In my mind, I genuinely believed I came across as sober because in my head, I felt coherent. I didn't feel like I was slurring. I didn't feel wobbly. So I was always like, oh no, I'm good. Then I would constantly get that 3:00 AM anxiety and people the next day would be like, oh, how are you feeling? And I'm like, fine. I like, I was fine even though I didn't feel fine and I wasn't fine. I was in complete denial or honestly lack of awareness of how I actually was when I was drinking. I was definitely, like I said, a binge drinker. I would black out more commonly than I think is normal, but because other people would, or because college culture or whatever, I was like, oh, no big deal. This is normal, right? Blacking out's normal, falling over is normal. Typically getting in fights totally normal, which. Not a great drinking history. And my mom had, everyone uses different terms, but alcohol use disorder my entire life growing up. And I always said that will never be me. That I would never do that to my kids. That will never be me. And that's probably the most famous line because I think every person it's ever happened to, probably at one point in time said, that will never be me. I'm not gonna let that happen. But like words are only words and it's a progressive, insidious habit and creeps up on you. So I had tons of red flags. Sometimes I hate even reflecting because I'm like, Ugh, I was a Jekyll and hide drinker too. Just all of these positive things where you'd be like, why didn't you stop? But I would get to a certain point in the night and. Suddenly it was like, I would be mean to people, to my friends, not to random people, to people that I liked, people that I cared about, people that I respected, but this other side would come out and I would always play it back and try to understand why. If I remembered it or if someone told me about it, I would feel the most amount of shame and guilt because sober, I would never say or do those things. I would never consciously be hurtful towards someone, so I couldn't figure out where it came from. And then the more I reflected on it, I realized that typically, it was usually someone I really liked or admired or almost I wasn't jealous of them. In a sense, but it was something I admired about them or something. I was like, oh, I wish I was that analytical, or I w I wish I had that. So all of a sudden when I would be drinking they would come into my line of fire and I couldn't figure it out. I still like, ugh, I hate thinking back to that. Yes, my mom ended up, I, and it's one of those things where it shows me the power of addiction because she. Struggled my whole life. I remember reaching into her purse when I was in public school and she was like, what are you doing? And I think I was grabbing money for the next day or something, and my fingers touched liquid, which was wine because she was hiding it. And I remember the slow progression and having different conversations with her it's really interesting looking back. She passed away four years ago. She had early onset dementia, largely induced from alcohol and then breast cancer and an aggressive form of cancer in her mouth. She smoked as well but smoking and drinking, all of those things, but it shows me the power of addiction. When I saw that happening, I went through those painful experiences with her and I kept drinking. So it's one of those things, right? Anyone from the outside looking in would be like, what's your stop? How is seeing that? Not terrifying, but it's that pull, right? And unfortunately in my twenties, I was introduced to cocaine. Not introduced. It wasn't forced on me. And that is probably one of the worst possible discoveries because suddenly I'm not falling down and I'm not messy and I'm not fighting with people and I'm not losing my cell phone. I'm in control now. Wow. You're so far from control. There's nothing in control.

Tracey: 5:50

And it's so highly addictive too. Absolutely. Then it's there. He's in a pod, while my mom's health was declining, I was in a, an unhealthy relationship, basically co-dependent nothing good was happening. And instead of looking at hey, maybe if you removed some of these substances or vices easy to say, looking back. Of course. But I lost my license. I lost a job. I had three brain bleeds and a grade three concuss. From rolling my vehicle, I should not be alive. They deemed it a miraculous recovery and I, oh, it's so hard to say out loud because I ended up some of that I don't even really remember. That's when my mom was put into a long-term nursing care facility because her health declined and. I can look back and be like I understand that I used alcohol and cocaine at that point in time as a complete escape. At one point or another, that escape turned into addiction. I completely lost control. I knew that what I was doing was wrong. I didn't necessarily, It's weird because I can look back and I'm like, I know the pain that I caused my family. I know the pain that I caused other people. And now being so far removed from it, I'm like, I see why I used it as a coping mechanism, in a completely unhealthy way. I am very accountable to that, but I also completely understand. I became a toxic person it's not because of a toxic relationship. It's not because this was happening, it's because I became this version I was that toxic person and It sucks sometimes, right? you think back and you're like, oh my gosh. And again, from the outside looking in, Hailey, you literally almost died more than once. You gotta see that. You gotta put the bottle down. And I remember one day my dad had said to me like, you're not gonna find what you're looking for in the bottom of a bottle. And I think that was when my mom passed away. He is like, you're not gonna find it there. I was like, yep, I know. And I ended up stopping drinking the month after she passed, which was the best decision I've ever made. But after the brain injury again, you would think that I would've stopped. I didn't, and my response to alcohol was like terrifying to me because one was never enough I just wanted more. How long did you continue to drink Hayley, after your accident?

Hayley: 8:15

It was a while that I had recovery. Someone else asked me that and I was like, that timeline for me is blurred. I wanna say probably four or five months maybe. I would have to honestly ask someone. And then I woke up extremely hungover one morning in December, which was the month after my mom passed. Can I ask you something about your mom? Yes, of course. Was your mom sober when she passed away? Had she ever gotten sober or, yes. So she did because of her dementia. She stopped eating basically she would eat French onion soup every single night. That was it. And then she stopped and she would drink, and I think she was around 78 pounds when she went into the nursing home facility. And she would fall down the stairs and so I remember getting home. One day, I think this was prior to my car accident, and her face was bruised from falling, but she was like gray and I found her on the couch with a glass of wine, keeled over, and I thought she had passed away. So she was in a very unhealthy state, 78 pounds. But the crazy part is she went into the nursing care home facility. I think I'm saying that wrong every time, but she went in there. No withdrawal. Didn't ask for drinks. Just that was it. So she was sober before she passed, but she wasn't necessarily intentionally yeah. She was different, but she was sober. Yes. Yeah. Who knows? Whatever was going on in her mind may have made her forget about the fact that she even had the addiction to the alcohol. Yeah. Yeah, it was, and it was crazy. We expected. Some kind of withdrawal we would always be like, you gotta go see a doctor. We would've thought her liver would've been failing earlier on and she would never wanna go, but any checks that she had were always fine. So it was a very quick transition. But yeah. Okay. Sorry, I interrupted you. You were talking about after your accident believe when you obviously eventually decided to get sober. Yeah. Yeah. I was so hungover I don't really know how to describe it. So this was when I ended up doing a year, no drinking sobriety, like loved life, so happy, and then I, made a mistake and thought I could drink again. And then now I'm at my two and a half, almost three years, I think. I don't count. But when I woke up one morning in December, I was so hungover and so full of guilt and shame from my past relationship and just letting myself get to where I did, I literally had no idea who I was anymore. And I was like this can't be it. You gotta choose something and you gotta switch. Pretty big here. And I had known that there was a detox center near me and I was like, okay, we'll just call. And I'm a really anxious overthinker, I'll overthink pretty much everything. And I've now learned about the Mel Robbins habit of five seconds, countdown. Mm-hmm. And just do it. And I'm like, that's what I did. I didn't know about it, but at the time I was like I gotta do something. I gotta do something and I wanna change. And I just, I don't, I needed. To be out of my environment. I felt at that time, and I just needed to be separate from alcohol. And I was like, and then I'm good, but I gotta do something different. And I got my sister to drop me off and she said it was the hardest thing in the world to leave me because she was like, oh God. And I'm like, bye, go. Like I am. I was so ready. And I don't know where that switch came from, but it was like, I just can't I can't be doing this anymore. I want to live so I went there I think within two days they were like, yeah, you can go. Cuz I was like, how long am I here for? What's going on? What's the plan here? Because they would do morning meetings and talk and go through affirmations and different things, but I was like, don't really know what the plan is. And within three days, yeah, they were like, you're good to go. And it was my mom's one month anniversary of her passing on the Friday, I think, which would've been five days. And I said, I don't know. If you need the beds, like by all means, I will leave. And I said, but my family was scattered. And it wasn't, to be honest, it wasn't that I thought I was going to drink, but it was like, for when I got sober the first morning, I had my first belly laugh. that I had in, I don't even know how long with like genuine. This reminder that things can be fun. You can have fun. You don't need any substance. So I just wanted to stay there. And they were like, yep, okay, cool. Great. And it was just this really strange and powerful shift and it was comforting to know that I wasn't alone in what I was going through, because. Part is so terrifying and overwhelming. So just to be able to talk to other people and not feel like I had three eyeballs, or they were like, what are you saying? So the year, and I hate saying the word easy. I hate it. I hate it. But the year was easy. There wasn't a great, there wasn't a trigger like, and my dad was. Do you want us to clear the house at Christmas? We always met up with my mom's best friend who was like, we call her Yum, your other mom, because she's like my second mom. And they were like, we don't have to drink. And I'm like, no, you guys are good. And I said, I'll probably be more uncomfortable if you don't. I'm fine. But it was this realization when I was there, I'm like, I know. It's still gonna be bad days. There's still gonna be people around me drinking and doing cocaine and not around me. I'm not gonna surround myself with those people. But that world is still gonna exist, but it doesn't have to exist to me. And I was like, and it doesn't matter what anyone else does because I don't have to do it. So were you still in the toxic relationship, Hailey, or had you ended that? No. No. Okay. I think when I rolled my car, I had tried to leave three times. Because it wasn't, it just wasn't a healthy relationship. Even when I go back and share my story, I don't touch on it that much because I'm like, I was toxic, so I'm never gonna sit there and say it was all one other person, because I know 100% towards the end I was sneaking around lying.

Tracey: 14:12

Yeah, we always say like energy attracts like energy, right? Oh my gosh, a hundred percent. When you're not in a good place, and I can even say when I was probably at the peak of my drinking, you're not making good decisions for yourself. No. So obviously you're not choosing good people to be in relationships with or engage with, and you're surrounding yourself with people like that low vibration. Yeah. Yeah, we can relate. Yeah. Yeah, that to me, all of those affirmations I tell people, I'm like, they might sound cheesy. But you're gonna look back and all of a sudden be like, oh wait, that applies, or That's true. And even with that, it's so interesting cuz I always heard don't date until you've been sober a year. And I followed it. People can do what works for them. It's so interesting when you say about the vibration because, and I remember reading the unexpected joy of being sober and she had mentioned a relationship and she's I didn't choose him. My addiction did. And that's how I was. I was like, dang, that's a good point.

Hayley: 15:12

Yeah. And I look back and I'm like, oh, that 100%. So it was really interesting. I took a year. And my thing was I didn't read quit lit in the beginning. I didn't even know, I didn't even know this whole world was available. And I think it's so cool. And that's why I'm so passionate about being part of it is because having these resources be available to people and no shame is incredible. But I poured myself because I remember sitting on the couch and being like, yes, I'm sober. I'm frigging doing this. I'm loving it. And then I. What do you even like doing? Who are you at this point in time and my self worth from, that relationship and just from my view of myself was horrible. Literally horrible. So I read you're a Badass by Jen Sincero I loved that book and just different mindset books and I follow a lot of Dr. Joe Dispenza to understand the mind, to really rebuild who I was. And then I ended up meeting someone and it is like the most night and day insane. Once I raised my vibration. Yes. Yeah. What you're saying, like it's so true. Yeah. So what happened? Go back to tell us. So you had a relapse. Sure did. I sure did. I thought I was the exception, like we all do, right? I think it was because I what is it? Annie Grace says it 100% a breeze. 90% is a bitch. So door closed, doors closed. That was easy for me. The concept of moderation was this false confidence that I got. So it was easy for me for the year because I was like, I'm not doing it. And I knew it wouldn't bring anything good into my life, but I, yeah. Thought, I thought no triggers or cravings meant well, you would totally be in control this time because that's obviously how it works. And within my first drink, I realized that was 100% not the case at all, which was terrifying. Until I sidelined me. It took me down for seven months and someone actually asked me. It was really interesting. I think he's a Dr. Adi j he has a program. I'm probably saying his name wrong, not sure, but he was talking on a live and talking about moderation. And I said, I think it's a dangerous topic just through my experience. And he is yeah, that's through your experience. And he said, what made you drink again? And I was like I believed I could. Cuz he's you just said you had the happiest year of your life. You were very happy. And I was like, oh, things were amazing. And he's okay, so why did you choose to drink again? And I'm like, because I thought I could. And he's no, there's a belief associated with why you did it. And I was like, I believed that I could. And he's I don't think so. And I'm like, okay, I do. And I was like, okay, cool. Thanks. Whatever. Two weeks later, because I, like I said, I'm an overthinker. I'm laying in bed. And I was like, what did he mean? And then all of a sudden it hit me and I was like, yes. That was a part of it. I didn't wanna be the girl who couldn't drink. So it was ego-based, right? 100% based on ego or based on pride or whatever you wanna call it. I just wanna be able to love one or two to say I can have one or two. I just. For whatever reason I created a story 100% me, 100% the author. I thought that my boyfriend wouldn't want to introduce his sober girlfriend. Meanwhile, he definitely wouldn't wanna introduce drinking Hayley. So that was stupid. Yeah. It was one of those things where it was my own insecurity that I turned into a story and Right. That made me. Try to drink again, which I could look back on it with guilt and shame. I look back on it as lessons learned and it gave me closure and like a final nail in the coffin. I'm not curious about it. I'm not interested. I know how my brain is going to respond to alcohol, and I know my life is so full and fundamentally better without it. My curiosity is killed.

Tracey: 19:10

It's interesting what you say about the moderation, because we speak about that a lot too. Yeah. And the more I've learned from people on this podcast, I think in general addicts, are an all or nothing, right? Yeah. Type of, yeah. Mentality. Yeah. And not only that, what I've also learned is I think anybody out there that can't just have one, and there's a lot of. Totally. You should probably consider your relationship with alcohol. Yeah. Because, I think that's the rabbit hole. We've all gone down at one point or another.

Hayley: 19:45

Yeah. Yeah. I think that's what drew me to this naked mind, that's where I got my certification, but I. The fact that when you read the book it's not trying to sway you any which way. After I read it, I think I had already quit drinking, but I was like, alcohol's a freaking cigarette like this. I've never smoked a day in my life. And that is the visual that I got from it. It, removed any desire for me and I didn't have any anymore anyways, because I know. I'm happy without it. I know I can be social, all of those things. It's a matter, I had to rebuild a lot of that. And I think that's a really hard part is Yeah. I've talked to, a lot of people lately who thought, because they see in groups about your anxiety goes away or all of these things, cuz that's what a lot of people have. And I'm like, but if you've had anxiety all along, like I do, I still have. But I'm able to manage it and I read books to learn about it. I want to be in control of all of those things, or at least just, understanding or more comfortable. But it's also like your life might look different without alcohol, but it doesn't have to mean that in a bad way. If you go out less, it's not a bad thing. And you might be more comfortable, you might be relaxing, you might be getting closer to family, you might be reading more books and growing and getting personal development. I just think the whole idea. Sober is boring or all of, I don't know, all of those fears. That's why I love these communities and having these discussions, yeah, for sure. We're all making it cool, aren't we? Exactly.

Lindsey: 21:12

Haley, I just have to say I've never had somebody articulate. My experience with alcohol and how I react to it. Yeah. As well as you just did. I was the girl that got mean and ugly to the people that she loved. My spouse, my sisters, my friends. When you said that, like the hairs on the back of my neck just stood up. I was like, holy shit. That was me. Yeah. And Yeah. Just how you would black out a lot. That was me. It became at the end, almost every, it did every time I drank. Yeah. I was blackout, whether I was alone drinking by myself as I often did wine and trying to watch Netflix at home. Yeah. It ended in a blackout every single time. Yeah. And when you said I became the toxic person, I was like, oh my god. That was me. Yeah. We did become toxic. We became things we didn't wanna be. Yeah. And I'll be honest, sometimes like this December is gonna be four years alcohol free for me. And I think sometimes I miss it, I miss the freedom and not feeling in control. But then, I'm very similar to you. I don't ever just have one, and this just verifies, clarifies everything. I don't wanna go back. And when you said okay, you were happy for that year that you didn't drink, but you had a slip up and you went back, like, why? And sometimes I often think, oh, I just wanna see if I can just have one, but I already know I'm not gonna be able to. And just how you didn't want to be the person who couldn't. I was like, oh my God, it's all ego-based. Are we the same person? I dunno. This is so crazy. Wow, all these things were going off in my head as you were talking. And I was like, I'm just gonna sit here and listen to everything. And for me, I fell and tripped at home and broke my fricking collarbone and had to have emergency surgery the next day to fix it. Do you think that I stopped after that? No. No. Don't you think that's enough to be like, Hey, Lynn's, we should maybe. Not consume the substance. Yeah. That makes you outta control and a toxic mean person and you're right, I married somebody that if I wasn't drinking, I never would've, I never would've chose to be with that person. Yeah. And it wasn't fair to him or me. But when you said your addiction chose the person, I was like, holy shit. It almost enabled me to be the drinking toxic person because, the person that I was with also participated and even encouraged it. Yeah. Yeah. Anyways. Wow. Haley, thank you for sharing that story. That's insane. Yeah. That's crazy how many things relate and connect. But that's again, another example of oh my God, I'm the only person this has happened to. Or My story is so bad. Or, yeah, the only Kyline Hyde, or whatever the case may be, where you're like, no. A lot of us have experienced it, so we understand those. Yeah. Like heavy feelings that come with it. And that can be really hard to sit with.

Tracey: 24:20

It helps to have a community. It helps with the shame cycle. Yeah. Because you feel so much shame about some of the things you did and that's something I wanted to ask you about because it's something we often speak to and I know it's ongoing for us, how your journey with self-forgiveness has been and maybe some of the things that you have used utilized to accomplish. Because you spoke to feeling really bad and awful about the person you were or some of the things you did. So I'm assuming you've had to do some work with that too. Yes. Wait a sec though. I think Mike was gonna say something there. I thought I heard him chime in.

Mike: 25:03

I was just gonna ask, how old were you when you started drinking? Oh my gosh, grade eight. I don't even remember how old we are in grade eight.. Oh my God. Cause I've talked about this before and I'm like, you know how RAs, or what is it? Raspberry flavored Smirnoff? Yeah.

Lindsey: 25:19

That Smirnoff Ice or No, just the raspberry flavor.

Hayley: 25:21

No, the raspberry flavored Smirnoff. But we were too young. Okay. Yeah. Dumb to realize that just because it's raspberry flavored doesn't mean you don't need. So that was terrible because Oh yeah, and that's an interesting part. I've recorded some videos on that, because addiction is obviously very linked with trauma and different things, and I am very aware and cognizant of that. But I was like, for me, and I think for some people, It's not to say that there hasn't been trauma in your life, but the reason I chose to drink was because that was a very normal thing at that time. That was an event. That was our grade eight grad. This is what everyone's doing. It was more to seek pleasure than to escape something or to numb something. Was just because this is what we're doing. Woo. Fit in. Yeah. Exactly. Like you said, the outsider. Yeah. Everyone's doing it. So yeah, we drank it. Oh, straight. I woke up the next morning sick to my stomach and I had to go to Canada's Wonderland, which you guys are all aware is all the roller coasters. And I was like, this is again, like that was day one. Should have been my first hangover. Should have been my out. I would've saved myself. So much trouble. Wow. Yeah. If only we were all that smart. Yeah.

Tracey: 26:27

Let's be honest, alcohol doesn't taste good how do you get, so isn't that crazy on it when you think of it that way? We're consuming it. Yeah. It doesn't taste good. No. You feel like crap the next day. Literally. Yeah. And we keep consuming it.

Hayley: 26:41

It's different for everyone. There's obviously the addiction component. Yeah. But it's also, there's so many beliefs to get through, personally I find I notice a lot of like worth beliefs, people not believing they're worthy, people not believing they're enough people being absolutely terrified to be without that blanket of courage. And to feel whole and seen and good enough, completely as is. So that can be a really hard barrier to quitting, I think. That's Wow. Wow. Oh my God. Yeah. Everything is fear based. It's all hundred. Yeah, it is. It's always connected to fear. Yeah. What's it gonna be like? What did I, everything is just related to fear. Yeah. And then that gets connected to ego. Everything you've talked about we hit on this with almost every single guest. Yeah. But everybody's got their own story, so it's Yeah. Interesting to hear it all. So it is interesting. It's funny you said fear too, cause I just did a alive this week on the three big elements of fear that hold people back. There's always a big fear blanket and even moving forward as a coach, I'm like, the things that hold me stuck is feared 100%. Yeah, but you can tie it all in. And there's fear of success. Fear of failure or fear of judgment and fear of success is what the hell is my life gonna look like when I give up drinking? Am I going to be able to hang out with my friends still? Am I going to be able to do all these things? Is everything gonna have to change? That all looks new. Fear of failure is everyone's gonna know that I'm trying and how embarrassing and full of shame is that. And then fear of judgment, like we talked about, being the one who doesn't drink or look at, all of the judgment and the stigma associated with giving up alcohol or struggling with alcohol is terrifying. Fear for me and I think for everyone, obviously a massive hurdle to get over.

Lindsey: 28:26

I think fear and perfectionism, I'm seeing this now go together because. I just started this book club. We're reading this book, I don't know if you've heard of it. It's called The Perfection Detox, and I have never had anybody word this. I've never read anything like this. Yep. It blew my mind. It was almost like the author was saying that perfectionism is really fear in wearing really amazing shoes. That's how. Masked, but also she talked about children of alcoholics often are perfectionists because perfectionism is activated as a way for you to control your environment and how you are seen by other people. Almost like for you to portray my family is the same as yours and everybody else's. And that in later life leads to anxiety. And I was like, holy shit. Because I had my first panic attack at 12. Yeah. And was rushed to the hospital and have had anxiety my entire life. And it's about control. Yeah. An ego. I think when you drink, because you're a perfectionist, Because, maybe that's a result of the trauma of being a child of an alcoholic, which I am. Yeah. Yeah, drinking. We just are able to stuff that all down and not deal with any of it. Yeah. And that's the part that feels really good is the escapism, right? Yeah, I just needed to add that in there.

Tracey: 30:02

It's not the taste of alcohol, obviously. It's the way it makes you feel or how it numbs the things you don't wanna feel. Yeah. It's the result. Yeah. It's definitely not the taste of it. That keeps us going back for more. Yeah, no, I know. I still watch people at the bar do shots and then they make faces and I'm like, you don't even this poison. I'm not like, I don't go out and preach to people, but I'm like, it's ironic, obviously seeing it now.

Mike: 30:30

Any of your friends followed suit with you and your journey?

Hayley: 30:35

You know what's actually so cool is I was texting one of my close friends before this and she saw me through the good and bad and she read the Naked Mind last Summer and she hasn't drank. And she just texts me about how she feels this whole new sense of self and respect and that she doesn't miss it. And she's excited to try new kombucha and different, try different drinks. Yeah. So I was like, what? This is amazing.

Tracey: 31:01

That's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. I was thinking about the fact that you had your relapse and we've had other guests that have experienced that as well. Yeah. And I was of thinking you probably had a lot of guilt and shame around that. But in reality, cuz we have talked about how. Regardless, we have no regrets because it's really created the person we are and we wouldn't be who we are without have having that struggle with the alcohol or the addiction. And I was thinking about, people that relapse and thinking, that there is some kind of benefit or upside to that because you've actually recover. Then relapsed and can know the difference and speak to both sides.

Hayley: 31:47

Yeah. Yeah. Which is wild. And I remember in my first year being like, I always heard relapse as part of recovery. And I was like, no. This feels too good. I'm good. Not interested. And then it was around 11 months with a sneaky little confidence. False confidence, thoughts, crept in and still believing. That's the other thing is you, Believe there's a benefit to drinking, whether it's, it'll relax me, it'll be more fun. I'm gonna, you think that something positive's coming? It isn't, but I definitely had to release a lot of shame after that and facing people. But and that's the thing again, and speaking to fear, sorry. Before when you were talking about fear, our brains literally fear the unknown. If I'm thinking I'm gonna get sober, but I don't know what the hell that looks like and that's terrifying. My brain's gonna be like, you should just stay put. You should keep doing what you're doing, even though it's a bad habit. It's familiar to your brain, so your brain's like just stay there as opposed to going into the unknown. Yeah. It was hard to sit with and I'm very fortunate to have an incredibly supportive family who said, you cannot continue to look back or you're never gonna move forward, and you will always stay stuck in that. You gotta release it. And I was like, okay. And I did a forgiveness letter to myself and of all my wrongdoings and I've had amazing. Honestly, amazing conversations and my connections with my friends and family are so strong. And I don't know if that's the gift of being in these groups and doing these platforms, but your vulnerability and passion for connection is just different. I think, I'm not saying like different and better, but I really crave connection and so everything is widely improved, but I was very fortunate. my support system didn't let me mentally beat myself up constantly and stay in that shame spiral. Honestly, as silly as it sounds, reading you're a badass and all of those self-help books reminded me that my struggle was not my identity. And I always say that now cause I'm like, Honestly, if it weren't for coaching or doing these conversations, I love doing them because if anyone else thinks that they can't come back from what they're doing, it's important for them to hear that they can. But aside from that, alcohol it's weird to me that it was a chapter in my life. I very clearly say it was a chapter. It's not the whole damn story, but it's almost weird because it feels like, A different part of my life. I have zero interest. It just isn't a thing to me that it feels separate. I remember seeing a quote by Gerard Butler, which he had mentioned, how he used to be all or nothing, zero to a hundred, but now it feels like a different life and he hasn't drank. It's just the door is closed, which seems weird to be able to think about, I don't know if you go through the process and honestly really peel back beliefs in understanding. For me, the fundamental understanding that so much positive is in this life and so much fulfillment and that there's nothing, anything that I'm searching for does not come from drugs and alcohol, which alcohol is a drug, but, so I don't know. It's just reaching those bottom lines. And I think a tough one is acceptance with not being able to have one or two, for people to understand I can't have one or two. And just accepting and understanding that and. Almost killing yourself. Trying to be able to be the person who can, and it's not worth it, right?

Tracey: 35:02

Yeah. I say too that people if they have some sober curiosity, they should really just learn about what alcohol does to your body and how it affects you. Because I can tell you that is something that changed almost everything for me. Yeah. Mike, myself and Lindsay actually came into this journey not saying we would never drink again. Because our relationship with alcohol was a little bit different and we started our journeys a little different. Yeah. But I think we've all completely done a 360 and have made the decision. I know for me, I will never drink again. Yeah. And a big part of it is cuz I can't know what I know now. I can't unlearn, you know how it impacts you. Yeah. So at minimum it's just not worth it to me. I care and value enough about my brain, my health, my body, my life. Yeah. That I don't want to be poisoning myself pretty much.

Lindsey: 36:08

Said, Tracey. I totally agree with everything you just said. Yeah, I definitely won't ever drink again, even though my mind likes to wonder about it or what if, or I probably could just have one. You can't unknow once you learn, I'll never drink again. And that's a bold statement to make because I came in this thinking I'm not drinking for now. I feel good now. And Alcohol doesn't align with me. Yep. Doesn't align with the person that I wanna be because I became that toxic person. There's just no place for it in my life. I can't sabotage all the progress that I've made physically mentally, and there's so many things coming up for me that I'm recognizing. Where growth is needed or a mindset shift. Yeah. And alcohol is just not gonna allow me to go to the next level. It will bring me down,

Tracey: 37:00

Absolutely. I agree, Hayley. Yeah. Talk to us about what you do now. So you're a coach.

Hayley: 37:06

Yes. Yeah. And it's interesting when you mentioned about alcohol and how bad it is for you and not be able, unlearn what you've learned because that's, even my friend who I mentioned stopped drinking cuz she read the book and she viewed everything from a different set of eyes. That's the part that I love. And even what you just said, it's so interesting cuz you didn't go into it saying never again. Sometimes that is way less scary to just go into it sober, curious or an experiment or You know what, just for now and then it's interesting because the values that you have, it's like, does alcohol. Align with the values and who you want to be or who you want to become. Bingo chance. Bingo or slim. Yeah. Great. So yeah, I do one-to-one coaching and then I do a lot of different lives in groups and host weekly calls just to connect. But I like doing different calls to discuss the things that I found really beneficial for me. So a lot of Dr. Joe Dispenza or a lot of different mindset or growth or personal development podcasts that might be aimed generally. You can crossly everything, right? And I don't know if you've read the Mountain as You by Brianna Weist so there's perfectionism in there, judgment, all the ways. It's transforming self sabotage into self-mastery. And basically applying those kinds of principles and helping people see how we do that on our journey to finding freedom from alcohol and because, things got real dark for me for a while, like real. I am so passionate about doing these presentations and talking I like light up when people have a breakthrough. It excites my soul. I'm very excited about it and I want to be able to talk to people about it prior, or spread awareness prior, because you don't have to get to that point. And my intuition was talking to me and screaming for a long time and I would be like, it's fine. I'll be fine. It's never gonna happen. Even though in my head it was like, your luck's gonna run out. You've got away with lots for a long time. It is going to run out. And sure enough, so yeah, again, another reason why I love being able to do this and coach is just to help people understand, and to express that it's progressive. So yeah, if you are trying to control it now and you're worried, but you're like, it'll be fine. It doesn't just typically go away. So even getting sober curious and reading in a book like this, naked Mind Alcohol Explained, where it's just the science and the information, just to get curious or just to you. Become aware of what the substance actually is because it's been marketed to us so differently and we believe it's this elixir of life because that's what you've seen and known. Whereas when you actually learn about these things, it can be a shift. It doesn't have to be never drinking again, but all of a sudden you may view things a little bit differently and that just opens a different conversation.

Tracey: 39:51

I liked, I was looking at your five. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I went into your link tree. I was looking at that too. Yeah. Yeah. So I like that because you know what? We're gonna finish this season with what our 12 steps would be. Yeah. From a LAF life perspective. So Awesome. liked this. Yeah, these five tips. Yeah. I think you have mindset, acceptance, educate, accountability, and let go. Yeah. Yeah. Now did you do any aa, Hayley? Did you go that route at all? Yeah. I went the

Lindsey: 40:28

treatments program.

Hayley: 40:29

You went into a I was there. It was actually the one month of my mom's passing, and I was like, I'm gonna go, oh, go. Because why not see I don't remember how long I went for. I think the community and for people to be able to go and speak openly, what a valuable resource. I think it can be like complimentary medicine for everything. For me, I'm more of it's great. My thing is I don't bash any resources. They're all amazing. I didn't feel the need to continue going and I just took a lot more from like the books and I really needed to rebuild and empower my mind. And so opening up the door and being able to talk to people who understood was life changing, literally that part of it. But I needed to build and. Someone had asked me are you gonna get a sponsor? Are you gonna do the steps? And like I said, I had that weird switch, this awakening where I was like, I'm not drinking good to go. And I said no, because I was very confident and certain, and I know that can be a blessing or a curse. I completely understand different things work for different people. But I knew the path that I was going on and I have not explored that in, oh, God, since 2018.

Tracey: 41:35

A lot of people don't. Yeah. Like the reality is exactly what you said. It's worked for a lot of people. Amazing. Totally. But there's a lot of things that work for people, and you have to find what works for you. Yeah. Yeah. And that's the cool part, is it's like a buffet. Yeah. Get the plate that works for you and go have your meal. I love that. Such a good analogy. That is true.

Mike: 41:59

Hayley. So who do you surround yourself with now in regards to your social life and things like that? Because a lot of people, that's one of their biggest fears. Cause we've talked about fears is yeah, what's my life gonna be like? I mean it. Yep. If I use the dates correctly, sounds like you stopped drinking during. Covid, and that was a big for a lot of people. Lindsay and I are pretty close in anniversary timeframes, we both stopped before Covid started. But what do you do to pass your time, if you will, other than Yeah, I started during Covid too. Hayley, so I, yes, sorry. You started, but you started after the Covid. Had been going. That's what I meant. I didn't mean to not include you.

Tracey: 42:41

No, I'm just k I'm just giving Hayley and I props, that's all. Oh, okay. Oh, it's interesting. I basically, okay. The crowd that I used to party with every single weekend where I was like going out and not sleeping. I'm not in contact with anymore. Not that there's, ill will. It's like we broke up, yeah, my values don't align. Like we're just different people in different times and that's the whole, sometimes that happens a hundred percent. And that's the thing I like the people come into your life season reason, blessing or lesson, and I'm. That was for a season. It doesn't have to be a bad thing, it's just we're not in the same space anymore. Other than that, I'm very close with my family. My boyfriend still drinks his friends drink, but not excessively. He's literally the nicest person with the best soul and most amazing heart. We met while I was sober. We took a break when I relapsed. And not in a bad way, he cared about me, but he didn't know what to do. And then, I think it was very beneficial because I stayed sober and he saw that my sobriety wasn't attached to him. And I think that's a really important thing. But they're good people. My circle is, My circle, what is it? I'd rather have four quarters than a hundred pennies, so I'm not going out like crazy or doing things. But a few of my friends have kids. I love being able to show up and be reliable and consistent and they know what they're getting. We still go out, I'll go to kids hockey games or go see friends. I'll go to restaurants, we go to bars. My boyfriend hilariously dragged me up on the dance floor and we were the only ones and I was like, I'm dying cuz I'm very anxious and I'm like, oh my God, there's everyone looking. But it's funny cuz he thinks it's fun. He is break her out of her comfort zone. So yeah, like I still mix in the social, people probably think I am definitely more quiet or reserved than I was and that is perfectly fine because I am, I'm totally OK with that. Yeah. Why are we trying to be this other person anyways, right? Yeah. Instead of not being what comes naturally to us.

Hayley: 44:39

A hundred percent. And I think that's a huge thing. People will be like, I need to be like who I was before or how I was before and not drinking. You're naturally going to change slightly and if your preferences change, that's perfectly okay. I always talk about, instead of going back and thinking you have to be who you were, why don't you discover who you want to become and focus on that instead? And if it's a totally different person, that's totally okay. Yeah, your idea of fun and things that you wanna do for fun can change too, plus you're getting older, you're maturing. Yeah. Really. Should our life be about parting it up at a bar when you're well into your forties yeah. Yeah, we're good. Yeah. I think in just natural maturity we should all be maturing out of that drinking or not. Yeah. It should be the natural progression of life. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Could not agree.

Tracey: 45:27

So tell everybody about some of the services you offer and where they can find you, Hayley.

Hayley: 45:32

Okay. I've always said I hate this part. No, you can find me at living over the influence.com and I have Instagram as well, and for that page, it's some weird reels, but a lot of quotes that inspire me are different facts about alcohol because I find that there's a lot of information that we because we're on this side of it. We know that it's very relevant and present, but I don't necessarily think. Out there or common knowledge. So I like to use that for my Instagram and I do one-to-one coaching. I either do that on my own or if people are looking for something further, I do it alongside a nine week program from Annie Grace with this Naked Mind just to. Drive things home further. It's all about your subconscious mind is drinking a habit? Does alcohol give you liquid courage? So you learn a lot of different things and I'm of in the process of doing my own videos to be able to provide to people when I do one-to-one coaching. And then, like I said, I'm in a community which I could tell people about if they reached out or messaged me, that they're more than welcome to join. And lots of coaches in there do lives and different presentations or host weekly group chats. So just to give back and have community.

Tracey: 46:42

That's awesome. I love, I can sense your passion about it and that's amazing. So I'm really thankful you came on the show and we got to connect This community is amazing and we've had the opportunity to meet so many wonderful people, and I love meeting you and definitely another fellow Canadian. With our good hearts. So thank you so much for coming on, and we'll put all your information in our show notes. You can also find us at LAF Life Podcast on Instagram and at Laugh Life in our Facebook community. So reach out. If you have any topic ideas or you wanna be a guest, please reach out to us. Until next time, keep laughing.

Kelly: 47:28

Thank you for listening. Please give us a five star rating like and subscribe, share on social media and tell your friends. We love getting your feedback and ideas of what you'd like to hear on upcoming episodes of the laugh life podcast. If you yourself are living alcohol free and want to share your story here, please reach out.