Gary Menkes, The Begin Again Podcast, Season 3, Ep.4

It's always a pleasure when we invite our fellow Podcasters to share their story with us. In episode 4, Gary Menkes, host of The Begin Again Podcast, had the ability to convey his 17 years of sobriety in such a unique and impactful way. Gary took us on a  transformational journey as he recalled his very dark relationship with alcohol and the unexpected shift that brought him into the light of Sobriety. Gary was aligned with our mission when he started The Begin Again Podcast. He believed by sharing his story and showcasing the recovery success stories of others, he could be of service to those seeking inspiration. During our conversation with Gary it was very apparent to us that he had followed his purpose when he decided to launch The Begin Again Podcast!

Check out Gary Menkes and The Begin Again Podcast at the following links:
Website: https://thebeginagainpodcast.com/
Follow on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/thebeginagainpodcast/
or on  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheBeginAgainPodcast/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/thebeginagainpodcast

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**Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this episode are not professional or medical opinions. If you are struggling with an addiction please contact a medical professional for help.

Music provided by Premium Beats: https://www.premiumbeat.com
Song: Rise and Thrive
Artist: Young Presidents

Resources:
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Transcript

Kelly: 0:02

Welcome to the LAF life podcast, a lifestyle podcast based on living alcohol free and a booze soaked world. My name is Kelly Evans and together with my friends, Tracey Djordjevic, and Lindsay Harik. We share uncensored. Unscripted real conversations about what our lives have been like since we ditched alcohol and how we got here by sharing our individual stories. We'll show you that there isn't just one way to do this, no matter where you are on your journey from sober, curious to years in recovery and everyone in between, you are welcome here, no judgment and a ton of support.

Tracey: 0:42

Hello everyone and welcome to season three of the LAF Life podcast. Tonight in episode 4, we have Gary Menkes joining us. He's a fellow podcaster Gary and I had the pleasure of meeting in the summertime when he was starting his own podcast, The Begin Again Podcast. Gary has been sober for 17 years and similarly to us, very aligned with our messaging Gary wanted to put a podcast out there that would celebrate people who have found sobriety and, brought themselves some success in life. We're very excited to have Gary join us. It's always great to have our fellow podcasters join us and get him to tell us a little bit about his personal journey with alcohol and how he. Got to his sobriety and started his podcast. Do you want to start Gary with telling us a little bit about your background or the beginning of your relationship with alcohol?

Gary: 1:41

Sure. Thanks so much for having me on. I'm super grateful to be here. You're one of the first podcasts I had found when I started this podcasting journey of my own. I still don't know how I actually got here. And that's that's the God's honest truth. Podcast was not on my radar. And it's certainly a sober podcast. Wasn't on my radar, but I feel like something there's a higher power at work here and there's a greater purpose and I felt that like really quickly, even before I launched it. It's great to be here. My relationship with alcohol. Wow. And what a tumultuous, I knew I was going to botch that word. What a relationship, what a chaotic relationship was for sure. I'm from New York, Long Island, New York. I think I grew up in a pretty, normal ish childhood. Born in 1974, grew up in the 80s, we were on our bicycles, a really close knit. Blue Collar Neighborhood I am still buddies with the same exact buddies I was back then. We're on a chat together talk every single day, bust each other's chops every single day. But, we started I guess somewhat normal, maybe a little earlier than most people, fourth, fifth grade, stealing parents booze. That's early. Yeah, it's a little early. Yeah. Yeah. Two of my buddies, they got held back. I was always the youngest one too but they're always a little older than me for some reason. I think that's part of the problem is always like chasing the older guys, even the group of my guys, they're a little older than me, seem that way at least, but Yeah, so early, regular 4th, 5th grade, 6th grade, A little more, 7th grade is when we got to junior high school and I guess that was probably the first time I found marijuana or started, trying weed and stuff, but, you hear the stories It's all stuff I realized in sobriety though, like I didn't realize, How uncomfortable I was or how much anxiety I had as a kid and I played sports I was your I think your typical, Kid growing up along out on a bike on we're on our bicycles I grew up across the street from a park a big park. I was the first kid there every single day It was the last kid to leave and I was you know, we started dabbling But you know when did the relationship really started guess high school? My dad was very active. He was active, not really drinking, but he had a pretty good drug problem, and I think that's one of those things that I hide, I was so afraid that someone was going to know what's going on behind these doors. I was always afraid too, like he wasn't going to make it home. Like I had this anxiety, my dad's not going to make it home and like literally sit on my couch and just look out the window. This is stuff that, I don't know, you call it trauma, whatever you want to, this is stuff, I didn't know these words until, until I was an adult, right? But, I found alcohol, started feeling better, I was braver wasn't afraid to talk to people, hear all that stuff, but I also got in trouble really quick, really early. I was a junior in high school, I was 16 years old, I was the captain of my baseball team, it was the night before Thanksgiving, this is a big part of my life, and I snuck into the bar, like the night before Thanksgiving, my town's like a huge night out. I guess it's like that a lot of places, I don't know. And I I snuck in the bar, three older cousins and a fight broke out with them spilled into the street. And I woke up Thanksgiving morning with a first degree assault, a police officer. And that was real trouble,

Tracey: 4:58

How old were you then, Gary? I was 16.

Lindsey: 5:01

Oh my gosh. Yeah, so I was like, it's funny I don't know how to describe, I could describe my neighborhood was the best, but it was like, you're it was a blue collar, there's a lot of guys that have been in and out of trouble like Bronx talish, I guess there's some, just some tough guys, but we all knew each other and they all took care of us. It's funny. My wife wasn't in my wife time, we grew up in the same town. We didn't know till meet each other till later, but she wasn't down by where I grew up. But anyway,

Kelly: 5:27

the other side of the tracks. Yeah. But you don't know it, like laughing, it was never like a thing I love where I grew up. I wouldn't change any of that for the world. I really wouldn't. But these guys started looking at me differently. I mentioned that because first of all, I was in a lot of trouble for a long time after that and. It was such a life altering moment that, I went from like this skinny little, baseball player kid and maybe getting some trouble with teachers all the time., principal's office still Whoa, hang on a second. And they started respecting me or looking at me differently. And the same for me, that saying is just totally me. I didn't get in trouble every time I was drunk, but every time I got in trouble, I was drunk. Was drunk. I like that from hundred percent. And yeah, I was in a lot of trouble. I've gotten arrested so many times after that, I have assault, got a D W I Disorderly conducts. From there I was just in and out. I was alcoholic though from the get go. Like I was, I was just different, even my buddies, they were no angels, they had fun and I had fun too. I was I was a wild man. I was, I mentioned this a lot is, when I was in grade school, I was one of the smartest kids in the whole, not in the whole class, the whole district in my, of my grade, they would put me in like these, different classes. I only mentioned that because by the time I was time to graduate high school, like I barely graduated because I wasn't doing anything. In fact, I didn't even bring books. I didn't do anything. I just didn't do anything. I love sports. That's it. I didn't do anything. I love to party. I didn't apply to one college. I went to community college my first year. We went to spring break, Key West, Florida, and raging alcoholic that I was becoming. I moved there a few months later. And I lived in Key West for a year and it was a wild year and, I was like a partier and I was a maniac and I mentioned that because I was fun too. There was times there was fun, I was fun to be around, but then as I got older and got a little darker, I wasn't fun to be around. I was a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde and, I did everything wrong. Like I have two kids now, I did everything you're not supposed to do. Like I didn't go to college. I didn't do anything in school. They're going to have to do a lot of stuff, whether they like it or not, but I guess that's one of the good things that come of it, I'll give you another story to like a perfect, I was started bartending. I'll be bartending Montauk, Long Island in the summers, bartending Key West in the winters. And that's who I'm going to be. It's just, bring on life, bring on party, free even now I do have I have this vision of it and it's still it's still so romantic to me, it's it's crazy, I still do have the sick mind, I see concerts and just, letting it all, letting their hair down, if you will. That's what I loved. I just, I loved the party. I had an abnormal relationship with party, and I had an abnormal relationship with drinking. I found drugs as I got older. It's funny, I mentioned my dad, so when I was growing up, I hated cocaine. I hated it because I would see all these guys in my house and rough characters, and I would find this stuff all over my house, and I hated it. You know, when I first time I found it, it allowed me to drink more. And so I was the type of guy I don't want the guy's number, but as soon as I had a couple of beers in me, I'd be like, call him, get it and let's go. And then I would do it all. And get him, call him back. And I would just think it allowed me to drink more, in a sick way as a sick alcoholic that I am was recovering alcohol now. Thank God. It did speed up my bottom, like it really, got me there. Otherwise, who knows, I don't know. But so I was bartending and a guy comes in, he's what are you, doing behind the bar? You should come to work for me. I own a Wall Street firm. I said, all right, here I am. No college degree or anything. He said, come see me tomorrow. And I went and saw him and I went to work and first time in front of a desk., I'm cold call. I don't know what I'm doing, but I ended up taking the test that passed my series seven. The place I was working at, it's like Wolf of Wall Street type place. That's what I was picturing. I was going to ask you this. In fact, I know people actually worked for Jordan Pelfer. They're older a little bit, but yeah, but that's how close this place was. Like it was apparently tied to him somehow. I didn't know it at the time. I didn't know until even like after the movie came out. So anyway, I passed my test, right? I'm like, you know what? I can do something with this test. As soon as I passed the test I left the firm, cause I knew there was something was wrong here, but I got my foot in the door. I started dating this girl and her brother worked at a real Wall Street firm, equity trading, one of the big bolts brackets down on Wall Street and he got my foot in the door. And that was February of 2001. And so in downtown New York my first real job, to tell you how green I was, I didn't even know how to answer an email. I remember like answering emails and caps lock. That's how bad it was.

Tracey: 10:02

That's a no, Gary, you were yelling at everybody, Gary, realize that by now.

Gary: 10:09

Yeah. Now I do. Yeah. Caps lock. You're getting yelled at. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, so yeah, so I start down there in February of 2001, it's my first real job. And I remember having to take my drug tests to get in there, as in fact, this girlfriend is now my wife and her brother, my brother in law now, his wife was like, you're going to pass the drug test, right? I'm like, yeah, why would you even ask that? And I was like, man, how am I going to do this for, I think 30 days with no weed or something is what I had to do, but I did it. And anyway, so I'm down there, February of 01, September 11th, I'm outside smoking a cigarette and I'm, five, six blocks north of World Trade Center. Oh my God. And that goes down right down there. After 9 11, I really ramped up my darkness. I always thought I wanted a family and, I just pictured myself with a family at some point. I was like, I don't want to bring kids into this world. Really, I was in a dark place and I really went to a dark place that was, September, a few months later, April 2002, I go out with the guys. I never even felt comfortable though. Also, I got to mention it to I've, I have less than I'm always feeling less than I'm not good enough, not smart enough. I'm not enough. So I'm like, here I am, the only guy in the whole place without a college degree, and I'm surrounded by Ivy Leaguers, with a sense of entitlement at least in my head, and I go out on a bender on a Thursday night, I don't show up Friday, I go out Saturday, I go out Sunday I go out Monday, still haven't contacted him. Like I'm still going at it like nonstop. And Tuesday I get a letter FedEx to me hand delivered and I open it and says, excuse me, if you're alive, Gary, you're alive. You need to contact us. Otherwise, your position is terminated. So I thought really quickly on my feet, I called him. I said, I'm here, I'm alive. I have a problem with drinking and I need to go to rehab. I need to go get help. I think fast on my feet and I go up to this rehab and, looking back, I had it in my head that if you or someone had said to me like, if you go to rehab, they can't fire you. Just so you know. I don't know where I had that. I had that in the back of my head. I was thinking fast on my feet, and that's why I did that move just to save the job for a little bit. And at that point it worked, but I went up to this rehab and it's called St. Christopher's and they call it the miracle in the mountain. It's in upstate New York and,

Kelly: 12:24

can I ask some, yeah, of course. So when you made that decision, were you. At some sort of rock bottom yourself, or were you just wanting to keep your job? Where was your mindset at? My mind? I was the last person to realize that a problem, but now my whole world was. Literally crashing down on me work. They were calling on my answer machine. When I say a bender, it was a bad one. I went after my father, on Saturday night, like it was bad. I think I said some awful things to my sister my whole world was crumbling down. And so to answer your question, and I've shared this Later in life, but I always said that, I never was at a point where I really wanted to take my life, but during this time, I just wanted to lay down in a puddle next to the curb in the street, and I wanted to get run over by a bus and like specifically. Run over by a bus, that's what I want, and I had shared that a couple years ago with someone that had been down this path and he's just so you know, if he did say that to someone back then, that's full blown, we probably would have to put you away, put you somewhere because, those are suicidal thoughts, and even though the whole time up until, Whatever the technicality is, who cares, right? I was in a place where I just, whatever. Like I said, who thinks that anyway, by the way, Hey, let me go lie down in this rainy puddle and get run over by a bus. It's very specific. I was going to say. That's not like tongue in cheek. Those were when I wrote my thoughts. So yes, it was super bottom, but I was a quick thinker. I don't want to say it's both, it was really, I went there to save my job but at the same time, I was in a really low bottom. I went up there to this rehab and I remember it like clear as day, like it was yesterday. It comes to around, I'm at my first AA meeting, first day there. And it comes to me. And I say, I'm Gary and I'm an alcoholic. And I thought my life was over and I was like, look what you did to yourself now, look at where you are now, man. Look at yourself what do you have to say for yourself? So I went there, I also remember smoking a couple of packs of cigarettes every single day. I read a lot of books there. I went to, therapy, but I was on the periphery. I was on the back, I wasn't like, come save me. And I left there and I didn't even put 90 days together and I was back out. I got back home and I was in and out of AA's where I got sober, but I was in and out for four years from that April to May 13th, 2006 is my sobriety date. And, what happened to me on May 12th, I don't really know, I've had worse bottoms, I've been in worse places. But I was sitting in my apartment in New York City all by myself, like I always was, I was at a point where I loved to be by myself. I was a full blown isolator. I would go out with people, even my friends. It got to the point where even my boys we'd go out and I would just Irish exit and leave and just go do my own thing. Because that's what I like. I just love to be alone. I love to be by myself and just drink to oblivion, and do other things, but, really alcohol is my first, that's my main problem. And I was a sick guy. I was a very sick alcoholic, and I mentioned the trouble all the time. And, if you took all the trouble I've been in you'd be like, yeah, okay, check, but take that stuff aside for a little bit. Remember that this same job, this Wall Street job, young 20s. And I'm staring at the screen all day and telling myself I'm not drinking tonight. I can't drink tonight. I don't want to drink tonight. I can't drink tonight. Young 22, 23 year old, it's not normal behavior, normal thinking for a young man, but that's where I was, I remember taking the train into the city and just praying that this train would break, I was on the first train, five o'clock in the morning always, and just praying this train would break down so I can just sleep in the train a whole day. That would make me happy. That's where I was. And they talk about, the mental obsession of alcohol and, I'm one of those that the mental obsession has been lifted I like to remember where I came from, where I was, cause I live in a lot of gratitude today, but I'm one of the people, the mental obsession and drink has been lifted for me. That was a complete impossibility if you knew me 17 plus years ago, where I was again quick I was sitting in my apartment all alone, my mom's one of 10, I'm the first grandchild of my mom's side of the family. And I have 20 something younger cousins and they all looked up to me and go, look, he's an athlete and works on wall street, New York city. Holy cow. They lived out in the Island. And I love these guys and girl, I love them as mostly that most is a lot of boys. I remember just sitting there these kids look up to you. Is this what you want them to see? They look up to you. I always remember that. I didn't want to do it anymore. I was never going to go back to AA, figure it out all on my own. For some reason, the next day I poured out all my booze. I had never done that before. I

16:59

called in a group at AA,

Kelly: 17:01

went to a meeting and I sat in the front row, never did that before. When a total stranger came up and said, Hey, here's my number. You have to call me tomorrow. When every instinct of my being is to be like, yeah, what do you mean call you, or tell me what to do. I'm just. I'm just wired that way. You tell me it's black. I'm just wired to tell you it's white. And this time I was like, I'm just going to do what they tell me. I surrendered. I really think I was given that gift to surrender, my journey and sobriety, started right that day.

Tracey: 17:29

Gary, you were saying how you felt less than, do you think that was an ongoing theme in your life prior to you even getting to the position on wall street? Did you have that sense? Always, or that was just part of maybe your disappointment in yourself because you didn't go to college and you didn't do or achieve those things that your friends or the people around you were.

Gary: 17:55

No, the feeling less than I didn't get it. I wasn't able to put a finger on it then, but I have that today. I have that a lot. I have, I don't know about imposter syndrome. I've had imposter syndrome, it's much better today though, don't get me wrong, I learned that in sobriety you do work on yourself, right? I didn't realize it then, but yeah, I was uncomfortable my whole life. I had anxiety, like the word child anxiety. I was like, Oh, what's that? I know this sounds ignorant to you three, and I guess it should, but I heard the term child anxiety. In the last two years, I'm like, Oh, what's that? I started reading it. I'm like. I'm laughing. It's awful. I'm not laughing at, I'm laughing at myself, but yeah, I had in my whole entire life, but like the job thing, there's a point too, where I'd say it served me because, I developed for many reasons, I developed a chip on my shoulder, I was, I'm very competitive in a way, which is a good thing. I think it served me well at times. But I developed a chip on my shoulder. I think it's because, when I was a kid, it was like, say no to drugs was like really out, really rampant, and I came home one day and I was just crying because my mom picked me up. She's like, why are you crying? I'm like, talking about, say no to drugs, She's what are you crying for? I'm like, dad. And she's like, all right and I was just afraid that people wouldn't know. And like I said, it was a tight knit community. We knew everybody. But there was these weird characters coming up to me. I know, your dad and I love my dad too, in case he's listening, which he's not, but I have a really good relationship with him today. It's been a lot of ups and downs. Through the years, but I'm 49 years old now, like I know this stuff stays with us. I made an amends to him a couple years ago, and it was the most freeing thing I've ever done my whole life.

Lindsey: 19:33

Wow. I was gonna ask that if you've ever had a conversation with your dad about how you felt as a child or growing up? No. You were afraid you were sitting at the window no, he doesn't wondering if he was gonna come home. He doesn't know any of that. The only conversation I had with him was me making amends to him., it took me a long time to do that because, again, maybe I'm just a slow learner and the immense processes is cleaning our side of the street up, right? But sometimes you just feel like if you knew where, and I'm sure we can all relate some level if you knew what happened to me or where I was or what it's like to be in my shoes, how in the world am I supposed to be the one to make the amends, for some of this stuff. I was 17 years sober. Now I was probably did it last. Two and a half, it was like two and a half years ago, and it was all other stuff going on. I really saved him because he didn't have a relationship with his sister and my cousins, his nephews, some big stupid family thing that blew things up, and there's a lot of lies. My uncle had passed away, and I had to go tell him, and I was like, you know what? I think this is when I should make my amends to him. And it was a hard thing to do. I immediately started bawling, which I hadn't cried like that immediately, walk around, like I'm some kind of, I don't wanna say tough guy at all, but, I don't know. My point is I immediately lost. And but I just said, I'm sorry for what for that night. I'm talking about in the bender and I said, I'm sorry for that night and I'm sorry for other things. I put you through, I have a son now and I can't imagine some of the, worries you must have had about your son, running around the way it was. And even though. When I was running around, I always had this in my back pocket, because of him because of the stuff that I've seen I always had it in my back pocket when I say that, this chip, chip my shoulder. So I came home and I told my mom I was upset. And so my dad had to have a talk with me, but he lied through his teeth to me. He's I don't, I never done anything. I don't even know what you're talking about. And right away. I was like, boom, like I changed, like I can see it right now. Like it totally changed. And I just okay, I'll trust whatever, like I didn't trust anybody. Even to this day, I don't mean to go on like a dad thing, but, when I see people look up to their dad today, oh yeah, my dad, so look up to him I get a resentment because I didn't have that, I didn't have that role model, but other people have had worse, I'm not supposed to compare myself, but anyway a long winded way to answer your question, Tracey, is I've always, yeah, I just didn't realize that I've always felt less than, but even as an adult, and even when I got on that training desk I really felt less than, like I said, but that chip on my shoulder made me competitive and I'm still in that industry right now, and a lot of people aren't, I don't know. That's good. That's good for you. Again, you're not supposed to do it the wrong way. But everyone has their pathway. You just took a little longer. It's okay. Yeah,

Gary: 22:15

I took a little longer. You're a late bloomer. Yeah. A little different path. Yeah. A little squigglier.

Tracey: 22:20

So when did your dad get sober?

Gary: 22:24

He never did get sober.

Tracey: 22:25

He never did? He stopped doing drugs at some point. But and he had said stuff as the years have gone by, He would allude to it like, Hey, some role model you had, huh? He never said sorry, but he would say

Kelly: 22:35

he's carrying something. He's carrying something too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And he said some other things but he never tells them to me either. We had people here for my son's communion as far as man, he's acting really weird today, and my sister in law came to me later. She's he just told me how proud he is of you. Did you know that? I was like, wow, talking about that way. You talking about him? So I don't know. Yeah, it was wow for me. I was like, really, wait, I was like, tell me again, she's he just went on how proud he is of you and what kind of person, you are. And it's funny, on my anniversary, my sober anniversary, my wife calls everybody. Don't forget today's his message is real and it's authentic. And. He means it, that's not to take anything away from, my mom and, she says what she says, but my dad's look at your life today, Gary, look at where you are. So maybe that's his way. Everyone has their way or, some people, they can't go there, whatever it may be. But from the time I made that amends to him, I'm good with him. Like we are good. In fact. It's like we have this we're all on the same level playing field. He knows where I stand about things, about some other things up, and during that amends and so we're good except I seem to keep bringing him up the poor guy. I hope he doesn't listen to this.

Lindsey: 23:48

Oh, wow. Gary, what kind of things did you do to help you on your sobriety path? Because it seems like just listening to your story, you were really like, it sounds like an everyday drinker. You would drink quite heavily or just binge.

Gary: 24:05

Oh, I drink every single day. Wow. Okay. Different levels. Yeah. I was drinking every single day. That's a lot. It is, but walking through life drunk and stoned, like for real. Yeah. Then even when I got this real job,. When I wasn't bartending, I was a drunken stone bartending is one thing, but drunken stone on, trying to learn some real life stuff like trading or just dealing with, I don't know, just on a computer, all this stuff, like real, or, I had a paycheck. I had insurance. I had like stuff that adults have, I never had, I was definitely Tracey late bloomer to becoming an adult. That's yeah. So what did I do? When I was given that, again, and you don't realize it at the time, like you can't put your finger on it at the time, when you zoom out, when I zoom out, when I stopped doing it my way. And like I said, when a stranger said, call me, I called them, the instincts in this body is not the call, another guy and tell him what I'm feeling, that's just not how I was brought up. You don't share anything, you keep it all in and you move on and you don't even talk about it, and now I'm supposed to be telling people, strangers, how I'm feeling or, if you go through the steps, we talk AA, step four, you write all this stuff down, you got to share it with someone. So if I was a newcomer just listen to the people. That have been coming around for a while. There's a reason that they've been sober for a while. It's working, it's like stick with the winners, find a meeting that you like, find people that you can connect with, but find people you look up to in sobriety, so many amazing people in sobriety. I don't know all three of your stories, but I know all the people that we speak to. My life's a complete 180 from where it was 17 and a half years ago. And that's what we all get. We get a new lease on life. We don't know that. There's not a big sign when you walk down to a church basement, it says, come on in, you can completely change your life. I just came in because I didn't want to drink anymore. I couldn't do it anymore. I didn't want to drink and that's all I was there for nothing else. And I say that with, I had been going in and out of AA for four years, so it just shows how I wasn't even there, I'm thankful for those four years, and it was a battle, I've heard this too I heard this in the rooms, and it's so me we were engaged in a battle every single day of our lives, and we didn't even know it, and that's what every day for me was when I was drinking, and, It's exhausting. Yeah. It's just a, it's a total battle, a belly full of booze and a mind full of sobriety or AA, whatever you want to call it. It's a real battle. It's a tough place to be. I'm so thankful that I came back and I went in, I was given this gift, like I said, of surrender, like I am not made or built. The DNA in his body doesn't do what, they're telling me to do, but I just saw, I was like, okay, I'll do it, and get a sponsor. Okay. I got a sponsor, and he told me to call him. I don't want to call him every day, but I had to call him. Yeah. Sometimes I called you. All right. You're all right. I'm like, yeah, I'm fine. I'm a very stubborn, hard to get stuff out of me. But even to this day, even, even now. I'm a human being too, right? So I'll go through stuff and, I'm much more aware, much more self aware, but there's times too, where I'll play the whole tape. I'll say, still say, I don't know if he can curse you or say, screw it. I don't care. Yeah. I liked that part of me too. I do. I was supposed to call my sponsor. I'm supposed to call and share this stuff with somebody. And guess what? Every time I do, I feel better. I do, and so I also been given this gift of an open mind. I realized, I don't know anything. I really don't know anything like gift of an open mind is really beautiful thing because my way is not necessarily what's right or wrong. There's two sides to a lot of stuff, or 10 sides to a lot of stuff. I say that to myself a lot, Gary, you don't know anything. It's I think I'm grateful for that too. I'm 49 and I'm, I still want to learn. I still want to grow. And, I think I'm so lucky or blessed to be that way at this age, go figure.

Tracey: 28:14

I think that's really helpful in your journey to that desire to keep wanting to grow and learn. I think that keeps you going But I also think that when you are in a crisis, those are the times where sometimes the other people know what's best for you before you know yourself.

Gary: 28:31

You know what the thing is that I've realized also, and this is why you need to share this stuff with people. It's because if you share it, if you're part of a group or a meeting, they get to know you. If you say I'll tell I had a widowmaker heart attack four and a half years ago, right? Oh my gosh. Relatively good health, relatively good shape. Walk into the train and I feel a chest pain. I almost didn't I get rushed to the hospital. My wife she's got me there and they rushed me up, put a couple of stents in. I bring it up because there will without a doubt be someone within the group, within that meeting, within that community that maybe knows what you're going through, whether it's like I said, I had a health scare or someone's having a problem with their spouse orindistinct. Anything, I'm happily married but there's a lot of people that gone through divorce and stuff. There's people that have Gone through what you're going through. So you share this stuff and say, Hey, listen, this is what helped me and they can help you that way. That's why you got to share. You got to be open. Raise your hand, don't just go to a meeting, sit in the back row and check off the box, go in there and you know what you put in really is what you put out. And I think that goes for maybe everything we do in life. So today. I'm looking at my, I'm smiling like I'm 49 years old. I have more goals and dreams than I've ever had before. Yes, I do want to keep learning. And I think the minute I stopped, using my mind as the, is the first day that like, my last, you know back nine, so I'm going to fight this. I'm going to use my mind. I'm going to, try to stay as sharp as I can. For as long as I can, but back to your point about that's why you have to go share this stuff, and I'll say another thing about taking a service commitment again, thick headed guy here, right? Doesn't get it like, Hey, listen, you're going to come here and you're going to make coffee every Monday coffee for, I don't want to make coffee. You're making coffee, so obviously we know the joke, right? I don't want it to go every single Monday, but I had to, because I had to make coffee. You're getting the message, and so you realize that for me, it takes me a little while. Oh, this is why, like the old thing about prayer right now put your shoes at the bottom of your bed. So first thing you got to do is get on your knees and grab your shoes. That's what's hard every single day on my knees in prayer and my prayers are all gratitude based, thank you and please, show me the way to help someone today I wasn't sharing this stuff with anybody either. Now, I share this stuff like almost from the rooftops, almost, I'm joking, but yeah. Being recovering out loud is a new term for me, but, just stem from my hearing these amazing stories of people turning their lives around. I'm like, more people should need to hear this. Yes. When I was early on my girlfriend, same as my wife now, I love saying that by the way. Oh,

Tracey: 31:19

I want to ask you about your wife too, Gary. I want to know what role she played and how she supported you through all this, because obviously she, it sounds like she was with you for the bulk of your journey.

Gary: 31:33

Yeah. Yeah. She always saw something in me that nobody else saw, certainly not myself. Maybe I show other people glimpses of it from time to time, but it always reverted back to. Who I was becoming, But she always saw something in me that, like I said, nobody else did. And I did, everything, almost everything I could to push her away. And, her family, at one point was mad at her. For being with me. What do you like, she's a bright, beautiful woman. She's a doctor today. She's a doctor of acupuncture Oriental medicine and Herbologists. But my point is her family's what do you do? You're going to hurt yourself with this guy. Like he is unstable. He's a bad guy, maybe nice guy, what, like actions at one point speak a lot louder than words and his actions. And listen, I earned all of this 10 times over, and so we had a lot of ups and downs and, breakups. In fact, on May 12th, 2006, we weren't dating, but I think I was a couple of months sober and honestly thought I lost her, I thought I blew it, and I just called her just to, not, I don't think to like, get her back, just, she has been through everything with me, she drove me up to rehab that time she's been there, she's seen it all, she's seen it all, and I said, hey, just wanted you to know I don't know if I got it, been going back to the meetings and it's been two months now. She was immediately so happy to hear that. And she came right over and I was like, anyway, she's my god. What can I say? We can do a three hour podcast on what she's done for me. She's my everything, and now we have two. We have a 10 year old and a nine year old and, Apple sends the iPhone sends those amazing videos. We just got, I just got one. I love that. Yeah. How do they do that to me? I don't know. And they put the music behind it and the pictures. I'm like, Oh my God. And you're crying. I'm like, what? That's what I mean. I said to her, she's I'm crying. I'm like, me too. Here's one of my favorite things I think will explain my gratitude and we'll explain, she and I, it was my 10 year anniversary and yeah, 10 year anniversary. And she gets me a card every year, when we have a little celebration now, the kids know I don't drink, they don't know the whole story yet, but so she got me a card and she's we're so proud of you, look at what you've done, look at where you are today and just think. If you didn't do this, Lily and Finn wouldn't even be here. Oh my God. And, that's as real as it gets for me because it's the truth. And my ego wants to not say that's, like I had something, but it's not because I owe everything to, to my sobriety. My children, my family is everything to me. It's my whole life, right? Everything is these three. And, if I don't get sober, you hear that property of my sobriety or property of AA, you can put it on everything you have. And that for me, it's really everything, it's my family. So yeah.

Lindsey: 34:26

You're a totally different person. You've reprogrammed your brain. You're fighting against ingrained habits and you've totally changed yourself.

Gary: 34:37

Yeah. It's it's possible, right? Oh, it is possible. And it's totally possible. We see it every single day. It happens every single day, and that's what I mean. There's no big sign of walk in or stop drinking. Yeah. Totally. But that's what happens. Yeah. Like I live a sober life now. Like I said, these things were not part of my being, they weren't part of my DNA at the time, but, praying, helping someone else, actually living a life to, serve people, to help people that is a beautiful thing. If you get a message, a couple of weeks ago, it was one of these crazy weeks. I don't know. Crazy weeks, like three in a row. One of my, really good friend her brother was drinking himself to death was in ER. She's a Gary What do I do? And really quick as I can't give me his insurance and We had him ready for a rehab but in an hour, Oh my gosh, Honestly the very next day another family member

35:34

had a DWI Losing his

Gary: 35:37

family his house and Gary, what do I do? All you can do is I'll talk to him I'm going to tell them is my story and how to me, there's no Hey, you do this. This is going to happen. Like you just got to share my story. And then there was a, it was like one, two, three, I'm like, man, what a week this is, but the truth is there's nothing that makes me happier or makes me feel more fulfilled or better than when people are reaching out to me for help in this sense, that's your purpose. Maybe. Yeah, I think maybe it is,

Lindsey: 36:07

and there's no amount of education or degrees or letters behind your name that would make you who you are helping these people those feelings of I'm less than people are coming to you for help. You're the expert here now. You're the one that people are like, Gary, we need you help us. And I think just looking at that, zooming out, this is. Your purpose like you're so well spoken, you just have this great energy and you're helping all these people holy smokes. You're definitely not less than wow, very much, yeah, laughing right like You talked about less than and then these Ivy leaguers and stuff. And then you talk about education. It's you're right in this space. I'm well educated. You are, you're an expert in the darkness. I'm well educated in the light, and I really like the light. You've got both sides of it. You've got the darkness. The ego, the stubbornness, and now you, you've got the other life on the other side of ditching alcohol. Wow. A hundred percent. Let me ask you this. Thank you. Yeah, go ahead. Have you ever thought to yourself, man, I just want to have that one drink. I've been sober long enough. It's been 17 years. I can have a drink. Yeah. So I went through a time and it was right around that 10 year ish time. Yeah. I don't know. I've heard. People I was struggling with. But I also wasn't really working a program. I wasn't hitting my meetings. And I was really feeling bad for myself in a sense. Oh, poor Gary can't drink normally. Oh, woe is me. I see my brother in law, he's having a glass of wine. Why can't I have a glass of wine with my brother in law? By the way, P. S. I never even liked wine. It was never a wine drink, ever. I loved wine. I get it. That's my jam. My point is I never even ever liked even having a glass of wine or what that even represented, to be honest, for a guy like me. And here I am feeling sorry for myself that I can't have a glass wine. It was also a low point of my sobriety. I was in a bad place. I was in a bad place financially. I had two little ones and it was a tough time. And I hadn't been going to meetings and I went to a meeting in my hometown and I'm walking into the meeting and I see one of my dad's old running buddies, one of those guys that was in the house, in and out of the house. And I'm like, he was always like a good guy, but still I really have a, I have a thing about a lot of these dudes. Yeah. So I was like, Hey, what's up? He's Hey, how you doing? I'm like, all right, I'm not doing so good. I'm like, I think I'm going to go drink again. You can't do that. I was like, yeah, I do. But I'm just telling you, I don't even know why I'm telling you, that's where I'm at. And so I walked into the meeting and this guy spoke and he's I was sober for 16 years. I had two kids. It was a mechanic. My dad was a mechanic. He was a mechanic. I like this guy talking. He's I thought I was good, and I went back out, and I lost everything. I lost my business, I lost my house, I lost my family. Guy was crying, and I was like, Because he drank? Because he drank. Oh shit. So I was like, alright, you know what? I'm gonna stay here for a little longer. I'm not gonna go test this. And so I immersed myself back into the program and I went through the steps again. I got a new sponsor. Like I just, I did everything again. So yeah, there's been times through my 17 years and even the last few years, yeah, I can have a built in forgetter. I can, how bad was I? I like that term, built in forgetter. Yeah. You do tend to forget. Don't you?

Gary: 39:31

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Plus, I have nieces that, I was babysitting when they're five years old. Now they're like 21 and they find it hard to believe some of the stories that I have, cause I'm different person, like you said, but yes, so I've had those, like I mentioned at the beginning, the sort of love affair and that attraction of just letting go, whatever. And so I'll have these little moments like, Oh, if there was a, what's that movie, the matrix, like there's an alternate universe where I can just step over here and there'd be zero repercussions and there'd be zero guilt and there were nothing that would happen. Then I'll jump in there for a day. Yeah, cool. I would sign up for that, but. That's not reality. So the truth is I really don't feel that way anymore. I've had moments where And it was moments of feeling, like I said, bad for myself. Yeah. I had mentioned I had some amazing times, like really credible, crazy, fun times, and I don't miss any of it at all. And it's funny, I had such a love affair with alcohol. Now I really can't stand it because all it does is it's a destroyer destroys lives. It's poison collateral, it's poisoned, but the collateral damage it does. The families is yes, horrific. Yeah.

Tracey: 40:43

I wanted to ask you earlier, Gary, about why you think that you were so in love with the idea of partying. What did you love about it? What did you feel like you're getting out of it?

Gary: 40:54

I just think it was the mask. It was putting on this mask and leaving reality and, checking out. Cause I didn't give an F when I was out I didn't care about anything. And I went at it that way, drove that way. I ran through life that way. I thought that's who I was supposed to be. I thought that's what my purpose was really like, to sit here now to think about this young man that I was to have the mind like that and this obsession. The alcohol was probably driving you, right? It was dictating your personality. I couldn't do anything without it. Could not do anything without it. Hey, how long does it take to get, to Montauk, I'd be like, ah, about 18 beers. Like, I laugh, but that's how it was it'd be beautiful out like Labor Day weekend. I think, Oh, cool. Let's go find a bar with no windows. Totally dark and a jukebox

Lindsey: 41:49

yeah. Like a dungeon. Let's find a dungeon.

Gary: 41:51

Yeah. Yeah. Of course. Yeah. So it was escape Trace. Totally. Total escape. And I would chase that escape, and that's why like the word bender is it doesn't really do justice. It's such a loosely used term, but it's a real dark, it's just, it's chasing it. It's chasing that buzz, that escape that's why I think you keep going. That's why I kept going. Like when I talked about the story, when, people are calling me and where are you? As I was, kept going, was out, I was escaped from it. I didn't have to face it. Low and behold, when whatever midday was this time, it was whatever, five or six days and I had to come back to some kind of, life I had to answer, I had to answer the bell, and what did I do? I said, yeah, I'm here and I have a real problem with drinking and I need to go get help.

Tracey: 42:37

I think it's amazing listening to how you were describing yourself earlier and what Lindsay was saying how when you were describing yourself and what your day to day look like I was feeling like what a sad existence. When you think of how you obsessed about it or romanticized it, and even just you wanting to be so isolated, it's just that total lack of connection to not just the world, but people and yourself and everything else. And then thinking about who you are today, it's just a total different energy. When you described who you were back in your twenties, and then you describing yourself now and it's like the whole energy of you shifted in that moment. And I saw the light. That sobriety brought to your life right in front of me is what I felt like. Can I tell you something that sounds so cool to hear, because. We don't see it all the time. I was the last person to see that I was even getting better. People around me you're doing better. I'm like, what do you mean? I was the last person to see it, but I love what you just said about me though, Tracey, honestly, is because I did have this energy and it was a dark energy when I was out there and I could be the happiest guy in the place and drop a dime, be the nastiest guy in the place. And you definitely knew I was there, whether I was happy or not. For sure. And I honestly, I would love to think, and I actually know that I, that dark. angry energy has shifted to a place of happiness and joy and helping. And I want to live today. I was watching someone today talk about I do this because I want to live. I was like, yeah, man, right on. I want to live. And so if you see all these stickers behind me, I'm looking, those are the past few years, just traveling, so I'm like addicted to the stickers right now, so sometimes I took everyone upstate in the middle of the summer. Nobody wanted to go. I love to hike now. I'm into hiking. I love, that's my freedom now. That's my escape is being in nature and sweating and then working out and then catching some amazing view. That's my place now. That was where that dark chasing that's what I'm chasing now, but I bring up the door, but no one wanted to go on this trip. It was like, Clark Griswold would have been proud of me. Everybody in the truck and we like bounce all around. Cause I saw these things like, it's, this place Letchworth. Upstate New York, they call it the Grand Canyon of the East. I'm like, all right I can't go to the Grand Canyon, you know now, but I can drive to the Grand Canyon of the East So I go, I ring up the door because it's eh, maybe I don't go but I get the sticker story, so I actually mely pack everybody up and go. And so That's so good. They're making fun of me love that. Hey Dad, no one wants to come to this. I'm like, God you'll thank me one day. Yeah. That's what I see. I see that light and energy what your wife probably saw. Yeah, glimpses of throughout the time you were with her.

Lindsey: 45:43

Alcohol is I don't know, advertised as something that connects people, but really it does the opposite. I can relate to you, Gary, because I did my best drinking alone. I preferred it. I loved just drinking wine in my house. Leave me alone. And it's like secrets like that, the amount that you drink and Secrets have the most power in the dark. So when you are isolated and you keep things to yourself it's almost like you're embarrassed. I remember too, even being embarrassed about how much my dad drank. My dad picked a friend and I up, when I was a kid and he was drunk and I was so embarrassed. I was always afraid. That my friends in school would find out like, ah, it just has so much power over you when you're not open with other people about what's really going on. And then once you put it out there, you were just like, with work, you didn't even realize what was happening. You were like, Oh, this is the way I'm going to keep my job. But you're like, I have a problem with alcohol. I drink too much. I need help. It's out there. And now what happened? You went to rehab you were in AA and it like was the springboard for you today. A hundred percent. It was the best thing I ever did. You're right. I always feel like I'm trying to be as honest as I can, but it's the truth is yeah. Part of that was to keep the job right, but if I didn't do that, but I didn't try to keep the job where is really the bottom to because like I said, everything was crashing down. Really, it was all crashing down, but if I didn't do that, my journey would not have started. And like I said, what's the one thing I remember about that is the first time I was in the meeting and I said, I'm Gary and I'm an alcoholic. And I remember as clear as day, I never, right where I was sitting, I can tell you the room, everything about it. Wow.

Tracey: 47:23

As soon as you say that out loud, you can't go back, right? You can't take it back. It's like that. It's definitely true for this guy. Sure. Yep. This has been amazing, Gary. Thank you so much.

Lindsey: 47:36

We're gonna have to make a laugh life sticker and send it to you. We want on board. Oh yeah. We pull right up.

Gary: 47:41

Absolutely. I would, you need to get on the door.

Kelly: 47:43

I wanna get on that It would be honor. I would, that would go right up. Yeah.

Gary: 47:51

So I'll tell you something this is me I am always coming up with like ideas or crazy ideas, side business type stuff. My wife has heard every single ridiculous idea in the past 20 years. So I was working on something recently and this podcast. Idea came and I'm like, what would I talk about? I do love to talk about, I love to hear these life transformation stories. It starting to come together in my mind. So I wrote out a mission statement for it and it was like, again, caps lock guy, no education. It was the best thing I had ever written And I was like, all right, I'm going to send this to her. What is she going to do this time? When I tell her

Lindsey: 48:28

I want to hear the mission statement. I want to hear it.

Gary: 48:31

Oh, I have it somewhere. Oh, I can send it to you. But so I wrote it out. I'm like, what is she going to do this time? Like she's heard it all now I'm going to tell her I'm starting a podcast. And so I wrote it out and

Kelly: 48:42

this is your wife, Gary, this is my wife. Yeah. She's heard every crazy story or idea that I've come up with in the last 20 years. I was working on something silly before that. So then this podcast came up and I'm like, Oh my God, I actually didn't tell her for a week. I'm like, what is she going to do? She's going to be like, Holy cow. You really, you lost it. You lost your mind this time. So I wrote this amazing mission statement out for it. And I finally got the guts to send it to her. And she's Okay. Stop everything else that you're working on. She's this is so you, this is amazing. Like you should go all drop everything and go all in on this. I was like, yeah, I'm like, all right, I'm going to, I will. And so that's how it launched.

Tracey: 49:24

See, that's what Lynn said. She said, this is your mission. It is your purpose. This is like what you're supposed to do, like your setup even. I'm like, you look like a professional, sportscaster sitting over there. I'm like, holy cow. You do. I was thinking the same thing.

Gary: 49:37

Yeah. These guys represent something to me. Really quick. Yeah. I'm looking, I'm like, Kobe looking at your like, yeah, so Kobe actually represents I told you I'm competitive and I love Yeah. So Kobe Bryant, even when he was playing I wasn't a huge fan of his, but yeah, towards the end of his career, and then since his tragic, passing, so he represents the hardest working guy in the room by far. Wow. Yeah. He represents, he was known as a great dad to his daughters being a great dad, and he represents a life short. That's why Colby's like my guy. If you want to watch YouTube Colby and some of his speeches, they will floor you. I sent him to my mother in law all the time.

Lindsey: 50:18

I love that. I love that. You have a wall there. That's inspiration and accountability and reminders of the man and the kind of dad and husband and person you want to be. Yeah, that's it's true. These guys did it on the athletic field, but we can find our lanes, and be the best that, and if that's just not just, but that's being a. Sober dad and a sober husband and that's pretty good thing, it's pretty damn good thing. Yeah Gary, thank you so much for coming on honestly I can speak for the three of us when I say that we've really enjoyed our time with you and your story and you are honestly such an inspiration and I think our listeners are really gonna enjoy this and you are doing good things and inspiring people Because you've turned your life Completely around And I'm so proud of you. That's insane. There's no amount of education, no degrees that would help you do what you have done, because I feel like some of these guys with these degrees, where are they today? Some of them are probably not doing too good, right? But where can our listeners find you?

Gary: 51:25

Yeah on Instagram, that's where I really focus sort of my social media it's the Begin Again podcast. You can find me there. Nice. My website is thebeginagainpodcast. com. You can find all my shows there. You can connect with me, email there and yeah, those are where you can find me.

Lindsey: 51:41

Amazing. And we'll link that out in the show notes for our listeners. And of course your podcast, right? It's probably on all the platforms where you get all your podcasts. So wherever you listen to podcasts, make sure you guys head on over to the begin again podcast to check out Gary. Thanks again so much for coming on the show. We had an awesome chat

Gary: 52:04

Thank you so much for what you three do. And I got to tell you, I've listened to a bunch of your shows. I had so much fun tonight with you three. I really did. And thank you sincerely for having me on. It's been a blast to Nice to see you again, Gary. Thank you so much again, Tracey. Yeah. And for our listeners, don't forget, a new episode drops every Tuesday LAF Life Podcast. You can get that anywhere you listen to podcasts. Don't forget to rate and subscribe to our show, follow our show, so that you don't miss those new episodes. And until next time, you know what to do. Keep laughing.

Kelly: 52:46

Thank you for listening. Please give us a five star rating like and subscribe, share on social media and tell your friends. We love getting your feedback and ideas of what you'd like to hear on upcoming episodes of the laugh life podcast. If you yourself are living alcohol free and want to share your story here, please reach out.